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Aptavani-8
101
Questioner: In that sense, it is an independent attribute of the prakruti.
Dadashri: Therefore, anything that moves about, is not chetan (Atma). Then what is the distinguishing characteristic (lakshan) of chetan (Atma)? You could say, 'That where there is Knowledge (Gnan) and Vision (Darshan), you can be certain, that chetan (Atma) is present’. The knowledge-vision (gnandarshan) that you see in the world today, is not chetan (Atma). That knowledge-vision is the distinguishing sign (lakshan) of the intellect (buddhi). So really, even that is not chetan, but the fact that there is chetan there, is certain.
In this tape-record, there is no knowledge (gnan) and there is no feeling; therefore there is no chetan in it. It does speak (produce sound), but it has no chetan in it. Who is talking to you at the moment? You do agree, that someone is talking to you, do not you? Should you not have to determine, who is doing the talking? Who is talking to you?
Questioner: The pudgal (non-Self complex) is.
Dadashri: Yes, it is the pudgal that does the talking, and it says, “I am talking’. Chetan does not possess the attribute (gunadharma) of speech. If speech were the attribute of the Atma, then is it not possible that sometimes a person could stop talking? So speech is not one of the Atma's attributes.
All the attributes of the Self are those of the Absolute Soul (Parmatma). If it had to speak or move about like this, it would become tired. Would it not get tired? Therefore the Atma does not possess a single attribute that could come to an end.
If movement was indeed one of its traits (guna), then it would get tired by the evening, and you would have to go to sleep. Therefore, movement is not an attribute of the Self (Atma).
All the attributes of the Atma are permanent. The ones
