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Aptavani-9
501
seeing has no meaning after becoming absorbed. It is meaningless. Questioner: Ah ha! He becomes tanmayakar and then he tries to 'see'!!
Dadashri: Yes, that is why it is all meaningless!
Questioner: So then what kind of separation do we have to maintain in order to 'see'?
Dadashri: After doing purusharth! If on the basis of vyavasthit, you happen to become absorbed with it, then do not let it happen and You remain as the Self; keep that separate, and 'see' it separate. That verily is the purusharth! Now such 'seeing and knowing (jovoo and janvoo), ' does not (generally) remain, does it?
The mahatmas say that they 'see and know' only. They all say that they remain in the state of 'seeing and knowing'. They say 'all we have to do is see and know.' I tell them, "That is very good!?!' But how are they to 'see and know"? Even when they make this claim, I simply let go. I recognize and understand that the first standard in school is always thus.
Questioner: But the karmas continue to unfold twenty four hours a day, do they not?
Dadashri: Yes, karmas continue to unfold all day. Then along with it, there is also the state of being absorbed (tanmayakar). But along with that the purusharth of keeping the two separate is also at work. However, that purusharth is weak in many places. Most of the time one remains in the state of being absorbed (tanmayakar). The whole day long, everything passes by in this manner without one realizing it. Then he claims, 'I saw and knew. Arey! What did you 'see and know' What do you consider 'seeing and knowing"? Did you see the ghosts?
What is to be 'seen'? If vyavasthit is engaging and dragging 'you' in the process of becoming absorbed
502
Aptavani-9
(tanmayakar), You have to know that vyavasthit is taking you' in that direction, so You bring it back into the Self, and 'see' from there the beginning of the suffering and how it began. Such purusharth is needed.
Do you think it is easy to, 'see and know"? But all the mahatmas claim, 'Dada, we see and know, the whole day.' I tell them that is good because they would not understand the subtleness of it and I will have problem explaining to them. I am discussing this degree of subtleness just because of you, otherwise it cannot be discussed.
Questioner: But this is necessary.
Dadashri: But whom should I tell? I can tell only certain
people
The attainment in Akram Vignan
Having attained this Gnan, You have become the Self (Atma), but not the Absolute Self. It is pratiti Atma - the Self in conviction (this conviction of 'I am the Self' is for ever). Then the prakruti has become upsham - it has settled down, yet the Self is only at the level of conviction (pratiti Atma). All our mahatmas have the pratiti Atma.
Questioner: So after attaining this Gnan, the entire prakruti has become upsham; it has quietened down.
Dadashri: Yes, it is more than enough when it becomes upsham. Just to arrive at the state of upsham is the greatest purusharth. That in itself is the greatest attainment (labdhi) and nothing compares to it.
Questioner: What purusharth is there just because the prakruti has quieted down?
Dadashri: That also is called purusharth. Prakruti will become helpful to You when it becomes upsham. So it will produce results when You do purusharth. Your purusharth will
